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Who will you blame for a no-deal Brexit?

  Quickbeam 17:47 23 Jul 2018

Hunt seems convinced that we'll all blame the EU.

Personally I'll lay the blame at the feet of weak government and wobbly opposition...

I think that there would be no doubt that in that scenario, the present government would certainly be the fall guy at the next election.

  Aitchbee 10:19 27 Jul 2018

The odds on a No Brexit deal to be reached before April 1st 2019 have just shortened slightly from 4/7 to 1/2.

  Quickbeam 17:32 27 Jul 2018

" a hard Brexit seems more likely. Chaos reigns"

Start hoarding now then seeing as the NHS is looking at that option!

  Forum Editor 17:47 27 Jul 2018

This is brinkmanship, pure and simple. We need to remember that Michael Barnier needs the support of other EU countries.

His personal agenda is to say 'Non' to every proposal put to him by Theresa May, in the hope that he can bully her into a bad deal at the eleventh hour.

Instead of constantly criticising our own Prime Minister for what is going on, it might be an idea if some of us took the time to do some research and background reading into what is really going on here. We're being bullied by Barnier, who hopes that we will capitulate. Perhaps he would do well to remember that as a nation we're not too well known for capitulating.

What Theresa May should be doing is talking to the leaders of individual EU States rether than Bariner - let's see what they think of the way that this is all going.

  john bunyan 18:34 27 Jul 2018


Why do you aver that we do not do our homework on this? I have lived in other EU countries and follow the minutiae of the Brexit in some detail. After military days I worked for a major Multinational, and am in touch with a number of economists and others. Today, for example , May had bilateral meetings with the Austrian and Czech leaders, nether of whom overtly offered support; interviews with cabinet members of Italy, France and Germany all say that Barnier is in touch and represents their collective views- ie no signs, yet, of a breakthrough. The Leave campaigners have ,so far , been proved totally wrong in being optimistic for a good deal. As we are clearly committed to Brexit, the gloves must come off - no divorce money, revert to WHO rules, and fight hardball on aviation, security and so on . We just have to face a hard Brexit , damaging as it will be, in the hope ,as in all EU negotiations, a last minute deal will be found. Please do not disparage those who are critical as being pessimistic. The Government clearly had no detailed plan for Brexit and have taken 2 years, fighting among themselves to come up with one. They should have tried hard to get cross party agreement, and been tougher with extremists like Rees Mogg, Boris, IDS etc.

Time is short and May and Raab should be working full time on the matter both with bi lateral talks and with Barnier. The EU Parliament could well scupper any deal that excludes free movement of people and will demand payment for access , making a farce of it all. Let us hope for a breakthrough but time is short.

  Pine Man 18:47 27 Jul 2018

Please do not disparage those who are critical as being pessimistic.


  Quickbeam 18:56 27 Jul 2018

And this time it's a well said from me JB!

I find that we get a very dismissive and patronising rebuttal every time we express any concern over the abysmal attempts of the current government to negotiate out of their stalemated predicament.

We can care too about the future of the country, but at the moment we look like becoming the first country ever to apply swinging economic sanctions on itself.

The Conservative party isn't good enough or united enough to do any credible deals with itself never mind with other nations.

In street speak, they've lost the plot bigtime.

  wee eddie 20:17 27 Jul 2018

I voted Out. Let's go.

Our Businesses will need to become more aggressive to export, some products we import will cost more.

This country has become stale and needs a kick up the ass

No Eastern Europeans available to work all hours and next to no wages.

Raise the wage rate and reduce the benefits for those fit enough to work. I live in a small town where there are a considerable number of people who chose to live off the State and work occasionally in the Black Economy for pin money.

Businesses can't get people to work for minimum wages. Well, they can raise the pay, it's not impossible

  john bunyan 20:33 27 Jul 2018

There is a myth about immigration.At least half, in recent years, have come from non EU countries, over which we theoretically have control. Also young Brits seem too idle to do jobs like picking winter vegetables or work in care homes. With or without Brexit immigration will not change much

  bumpkin 21:05 27 Jul 2018

*Businesses can't get people to work for minimum wages. *

Unfortunately they can and do but most are foreigners. Most of the original British that I know are not lazy but require reasonable payment for their efforts as I expect you do.

  Forum Editor 23:23 27 Jul 2018

john bunyan

"...Why do you aver that we do not do our homework on this?"

You seem to be assuming that you are one of the 'some of us' to whom I referred, but I mentioned nobody in particular, and was in fact referring to the country as a whole, rather than the few people in this forum who have expressed a view.

It's a fact that many people are blaming the government because we may be contemplating a hard Brexit, and they are doing so in a knee-jerk fashion without being able to explain why. They make sweeping remarks about the government 'making a mess of things' when they - and most of us - don't really have much idea of what it must be like to enter into a negotiation the like of which has never happened before. There are no rules, and no precedents on which to rely. While they are at it, many of these people take the opportunity to blame pretty well anything else that goes wrong on a botched Brexit negotiation.

It's so easy to say 'it should have been done better' when none of us have a clue about how we might have handled it, had we been at the negotiating table. Those who wanted to remain in the EU feel entirely justified in saying 'I told you so' when of course they did no such thing. All they did was warn about all kinds of economic horrors, none of which have - so far at any rate - come to pass.

Of course we would all have preferred to sail through the negotiations, getting everything we wanted but nobody in their right mind can ever have seriously thought that would happen. The EU is in a state of disarray over our decision to leave - it will have far-reaching effects on the community - and Michael Barnier is not alone in wanting to make an example of us that will be a warning to other community members who might contemplate doing what we have done.

No matter - all of these debates and arguments will be history in a relatively short time; we will exit the EU and deal with the consequences as they arise. You will no doubt continue to blame the government no matter what the outcome, but that will achieve precisely nothing. I will continue to be an optimist.

We will both continue to inhabit the same post-Brexit Britain and our lives will go on. Society will not disintegrate and other countries will continue to buy our goods and services. There have been far worse times in our nation's history and we seem to have come through them fairly well.

This thread is now locked and can not be replied to.

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