it is time to walk away from the EU

  roger.roger 15:07 20 Sep 2018
Locked

and keep our money.

tusk says deal will not work

  Quickbeam 08:41 26 Sep 2018

Very true wee eddie, I think that that's where the political historians will identify as being the start of Brexit polarization.

  Quickbeam 07:15 27 Sep 2018

Is anyone else coming round the conclusion that we are indeed going to crash out?

It's the most important political time in our modern political history, and we (me, you, parliament & EU) seem to have already accepted that the crash out is inevitable.

With Labour committed to voting down anything missing their red lines that are in contradiction of those that the Tories have outlined. With the EU having another set of incompatible red lines. With the Tories having internal red line divisions. With Labour intent on thwarting the sitting government before national interest because that's what our adversarial system requires by default in a two party system.

With all that in motion, I find it hard to be the least bit optimistic over Brexit as the FE suggests that we should be. The much awaited/predicted breakthough negotiation seems to be bricked up behind too many personal ambitions...

  Forum Editor 08:34 27 Sep 2018

"I find it hard to be the least bit optimistic over Brexit as the FE suggests that we should be."

I don't think I have ever advocated optimism over the Brext process - that was always going to be tough, not only because EU negotiators are terrified of making concessions that will be unpopular in some member states, but because of the internecine squabbling at home.

My optimism is really in relation to the aftermath - where we as a nation get a chance to show that we can not only survive but prosper. We'll have a chance to show ourselves and others what we can do, whatever the eventual outcome of the negotiations.

Jeremy Corbyn's attitude that 'we'll say no to everything, regardless of what's good for our country' is a vote catching exercise, pure and simple. Jeremy is so desperate to get his hands on power before he loses his chance forever that he'll say more or less anything that he thinks will be attractive to potential voters. It may well work - we'll have to wait and see.

Nothing is certain in this turbulent situation, but it does seem to be looking more likely that we may end up having to settle for a customs union with the EU.

  alanrwood 10:16 27 Sep 2018

FE

What you say about politicians hunger for power is not specific to JC or the labour party. Just look at some of the statements made by Borris and his cabal.

  Pine Man 13:10 27 Sep 2018

FE

I don't think I have ever advocated optimism over the Brext process 27/9

A degree of optimism wouldn't go amiss at this point. 23/9

Four days is a long time in politics;-)

  Bald Eagle 00:22 28 Sep 2018

it is time to walk away from the EU

Lived in Brittany for 16 years, selling up and going home to Blighty. Health service here poor, tax system bordering on illegal and generally getting worse. Can't wait to become a UK taxpayer again.

  Forum Editor 07:57 28 Sep 2018

Pine man

"Four days is a long time in politics;-)"

You want to catch me out, I get that, but taking a quote out of context isn't the way to do it. When I made the 'degree of optimism' remark I was referring to our future, something that becomes clear if you see it in context:-

".....just what we don't need for our future trading relations. We are not doomed. We will survive and prosper, but it will take effort. A degree of optimism wouldn't go amiss at this point."

  Quickbeam 08:55 28 Sep 2018

"We will survive and prosper, but it will take effort."

I see the missing end phrase there as 'in time'. We've generally convinced ourselves over the 'short term pain' phrase that's been bandied about freely and now accepted as an expected fact, but on the back of a decade long recession, I see 2 decades of recovery in the offing.

  rickf 10:31 28 Sep 2018

".....just what we don't need for our future trading relations. We are not doomed. We will survive and prosper, but it will take effort. A degree of optimism wouldn't go amiss at this point."

And by the time we get back to where we are now, with luck and "optimism" on our side lots of small and medium size businesses would have folded up. Just wish people pining for Brexit would at least acknowledge the damage it would cost to our country and it's people. I am afraid, "optimism", the favourite rhetoric of leavers, does not put food on the table nor does it pay the mortgage.

  john bunyan 10:42 28 Sep 2018

Utter chaos reigns. Labour Brexit man wants to effectively stay in , as to stay in customs union means accepting the 4 freedoms including movement of people. Corbyn and McDonnel want out as the EU would stop nationalisation if we are in. Boris, ( For me, clever but a buffoon who would be a disaster as leader) wants Canada ++, the lunatics of the hard right want a crash out. Most MP’s want to stay in; Scotland wants to drift off. Everyone is unhappy. Optimism must be our watchword but it is a struggle at the moment.

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