Hooked on raw HTML...

  barryoneoff.co.uk 01:25 16 Nov 2003

I dont know why, but I seem to be getting more enjoyment from a simple HTML editor than a WYSIWYG utility.

My first attempt a couple of weeks ago was done using notepad click here Since then I re-did it using an old Arachnaphilia recommended by Taran, and at least that takes the bother out of typing all those tags! click here I would be interested to hear comments on the code rather than the page, as I suspect it will not be as tidy as a pro's would be. Cheers, Whiz...

Just remembered I left out the "back to top" links, sorry, will add when in mood!

  Taran 10:49 16 Nov 2003

You're coming along a treat with this.

Here's a sneaky hint for you:

1. Open your page in Arachnophilia

2. Click on Tools, go down to Beautify and select Analyze HTML or just click on Ctrl+L

3. Click on the top right button on the resulting dialog panel called Beautify (use all tags) the follow all prompts to analyze the page code.

Note, Arachnophilia does not always get this right so be careful how you use it, but it can and does help.

Keep in mind that here are more ways to create an HTML page than you can shake a stick at and 'correct' code can consist of very different tags to get a similar visual page. What I'm getting at here is that there are several correct ways of acheiving the desired results, just as there are many ways of making mistakes.

If you want a real scare, look at your pages in alternative browsers. NetScape and Firebird overlapped some text with table borders and got one or two other things wrong...

Finally, if you really want to frighten yourself, use the excellent W3C Markup Validation Serive click here

You'll see what I mean when I say there are more ways of creating a page and getting it right, or wrong.

Good luck with it.


  Forum Editor 15:32 16 Nov 2003

is that a propellor I see on your head?

  Patr100 16:45 16 Nov 2003

Actually I can't comment on the code though the page looks good, but did you know that Cockney rhyming slang was an early form of HTML?
I was born in Commercial Road, Stepney (really!) but that's another story. I usually stick to WYSIWYG editors because I haven't taken the raw plunge yet but you're certainly doing HT*

HT = HTML = well

  barryoneoff.co.uk 17:02 16 Nov 2003

bit of slang on my website Patr100!

Taran, I will try what you suggest, but I am trying to concentrate on 4.01 Strict code and CSS, which I know a lot of older browsers cant handle (Netscape 4 being one of these).

The only real reason for this is that once I can handle that competently, Transitional code should be a doddle (he said, foolishly). It's only a pastime, but being in possesion of a UB40 at my age, ANYTHING looks good on a CV!

Thanks for taking the time anyway. I'm getting ready for take of now FE.

Cheers, Whiz...

  PurplePenny 20:46 16 Nov 2003

I too love doing stuff in straight HTML. It's so easy! I use CuteHTML which also makes life easy for you by offering tags and attributes ... and most of colour coding. That's a real boon - I can see at a glance that there is an end tag missing when the following line is the wrong colour.

Taran is right about the W3C validator, it is frightening, you just have to keep in mind that no-one is going to call round and beat you to a pulp if your page fails to validate ... well not yet anyway :-)

PS ... and for a *real* scare try putting your page through an accessibility validator .......

  Talented Monkey 22:32 16 Nov 2003

I first started programming about 23 years ago when I was still at school and taught myself BASIC, since then I haven’t looked back and have always typed in code by hand.

I think that HTML is one if easiest ‘languages’ that I have come across particularly for novices. I don’t want to appear as bragging, but I taught someone who had trouble turning on PC to create a home page in HTML. So there is hope for all!

Leaving vadility aside if you don’t quite code something correct then most browsers are still very forgiving of some errors and you wont notice much change.

I hope that people are learning from a proper site first, there are many uninformed and inaccurate guides and tutorials out there, learning a few bad habits now may take ages to get out off. So go to a site such as w3schools click here

Persevere in your efforts for creating valid HTML and CSS code. I assume you are using the click here at w3.org once you have that code its rather pleasing to show off the validation icons at bottom of each page!

Using a validator is also a very good way to learn just check every dozen or so new lines you write with the validator, you will be able to correct yourself and the code as you go along.

Although I wrote many a HTML site with notepad, I found that using text editors made specially for programming with syntax highlighting is essential, particularly when you have mastered HTML and want to move on to something else like PHP here is a freeware editor which I am currently using called Crimson Editor. click here

Last of all enjoy what you are doing and persevere!

  barryoneoff.co.uk 23:13 16 Nov 2003

I didn't know what the internet looked like until about 18 months ago. I wish it had been around when I was young enough to have been a whiz-kid rather than a Whizwrinkly!

Thanks for the links too.
Cheers, Whiz...

  granpa geek 08:08 18 Nov 2003

Being in the same age group as Barry and comming towards the end of the long and winding road found myself composing in HTML with a user friendly technology giving satisfaction, and I am now combining JavaScript not forgetting the Technology is advancing in all directions knowing there will be another tool to combine as the learning curve continues.
I enjoy your sites Barry, & all the contributors, as their personalities combine with the technology.

  barryoneoff.co.uk 10:54 18 Nov 2003

shame we weren't born twenty years ago innit?

Talented Monkey - I downloaded Crimson Editor, but will stick with Arachnophlia (version 4) as it enters both start and end tags with one button click. This saves an awful lot of typing and caps shifting for brackets.

  Taran 12:02 18 Nov 2003

Crimson Editor is a nice program with a lot going for it, but when it comes to a text web page editor much falls down to personal preference.

Some people like UltraEdit but I despise it with a passion. I've never been able to get along with it and appreciate it and while I can use it I prefer not to.

Others get along well with the likes of Note Pad and Text Pad, among many others.

It all comes down to what you like and how you use it. As long as your output is good, it doesn't really matter which path you use to get there.

It is worth spending some time playing with one or two alternative editors though, just to make up your own mind on an informed basis about what is good for you and why.

For many uses I still love the old and sadly discontinued Programmers File Editor.

Whatever you use though, it's imortant to feel comfortable and confident in using it and that can make all the difference between good and poor work.


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