Fujitsu-Siemens Lifebook

  [DELETED] 20:03 23 Nov 2003

I am in the unfortunate circumstance of requiring my laptop repaired. However the repair centre has said that it is an out of warranty repair due to customer damage, which I sincerely disagree with. Below is my letter to the company, Celestica, who are the repair centre for Fujitsu-Siemens.

1st Letter.

Thank you for your letter dated 13th November 2003, and the conversation we had today 18th November 2003.

The letter received has stated that the laptop I have returned to you is not covered under warranty because it is deemed user damage. This I am concerned about as I haven taken great pride and care of it and yourself has commented that the laptop is indeed in "pristine condition", and "well looked after".

Also we discussed about the warranty between yourself and Fujitsu-Siemens, who state to yourselves, that you may only re-solder a dry joint if this happens to be the case. In my case it has been noted that the plastic outer of the socket has become detached and the other part of it is still on the main board. So basically Fujitsu-Siemens are not allowing a replacement socket to be soldered onto the board, but instead only allow complete system boards. I would like to point out that a socket like this could be purchased from RS or Maplins at less than £5, and would understand if a small nominal charge would be made for this, which, ok I wouldn't agree with, but at least I would have my laptop back, and would not have to pay for either another laptop or an uneconomical repair cost.

From our conversation I have understood that there appears to be an issue between yourselves and Fujitsu-Siemens regarding what warranty will be honoured. Fujitsu-Siemens will not allow component level repair, but will allow a resolder of a dry joint, but not allow a resolder for a new socket?

I would also like to point out that if the socket has been detached, and is deemed wear and tear, and not user damage, the consumer law states that if a failure like this should occur in the first 6 months, the unit is deemed faulty and defective at point of purchase, and hence would be entitled to warranty repair/replacement or refund if not resolved.

I understand that the letter you sent me is a default template, and that actual user damage may not necessarily be the case here, and maybe an ambiguous statement that requires some interpretation, from Fujitsu-Siemens.

I purchased the laptop in August from for £435+vat, and the cost of repair makes this uneconomical and unjust at £499.84+vat.

I am a recently self employed I.T. consultant, which the laptop suited my budget and specification. I have been without this for 2 weeks which has made things extremely difficult, and have had to borrow one which is approx 3 years old. I understand all of what maybe involved in such a repair as I work within the I.T./computer industry, but not an expert, which I entrust to Celestica and look forward to Fujitsu-Siemens re-evaluation the situation for mutual benefit.

I require either a new socket to be fitted to the main board, or a replacement board under warranty, which I feel is fair under the circumstances outlined in this letter.

I have taken some legal advice on this problem, and will be contacting watchdog should the problem not be resolved. I appologise in advance should I need to take this further as you have been very polite and extremely helpful, and will give Celestica every opportunity to resolve this matter.

I thank you for organising a second opinion, with your senior engineer, which I appreciate, and thank you for your time discussing the issues above.

I look forward to hearing from you soon.

  [DELETED] 20:04 23 Nov 2003

Many thanks for taking this matter further with Fujitsu-Siemens, which I
appreciate, however I will need to escalate this to the very most highest
level, within Fujitsu-Siemens. I have spoken to Alan White, who has said
about the issue being black and white, and to the letter of warranty.
However as you may or may not be aware I will be taking this to the highest
level possible, as I have quoted in the e-mail I have sent previously
outlining my concerns. As Fujitsu-Siemens obviously do not want this matter
to be rectified mutually, I have no alternative. I will say Celestica and
all its staff have been most helpful in supplying myself with the relavent
information, and advice.

Please put this to Fujitsu-Siemens that I will be proceeding with the

1. All correspondance will be forwarded to Watchdog, who are extremely
interested and sympathetic in this case(and they say is not the first time
they have had similar cases with other manufacturers). I have also been
requested to forward all the evidence of this case to them, including
pictures, letters and e-mail.

2. Contacting the office of fair trading, and trading standards for there
comments on this case.

3. Contacting Citizens advice bureau, for their comments and advised action

4. Seeking and independant second opinion as to the damage caused.

5. Obtaining solicitor/legal aid, etc for the case to go to court.

6. Writing to ALL PC computer magazines, and supply them with FULL evidence
of my case.

I am most disheartend, displeased, and totally shocked at what I have had to
go through. I have taken hours out of my working day, as well as the initial
day off I had to take when I received the letter, where I stayed at home to
try to reach a sensible decision.

If the "bottom line" is such that Fujitsu-Siemens feels they can alienate
its customers, I will certainly not be offering my advice to purchase of any
such units again, from any source.

To close as I have said before, I have given every opportunity to resolve
this matter mutually, and although this has obviously not been the case with
Fujitsu-Siemens, I have no alternative but to follow the above steps
numbered 1-6.

I would appreciate an e-mail from someone in higher authority to re-evaluate my claim, under warranty, which I feel I qualify for.

  [DELETED] 20:08 23 Nov 2003

I have an Amilo D laptop, also out of guarantee but also well looked after. The screen has failed and both my own invesitgations and those of a repair shop have resulted in nothing other than a new screen is needed at around £500.

The Amilo D was around £900 and, although the computer works fine through another DT monitor, I can't use it as a laptop. Fujitsu were completely unhelpful.

  [DELETED] 22:52 23 Nov 2003

1. Exactly when you bought this laptop?
2. Who you bought the laptop from? Am I correct it was from Dabs?
3. Exactly when did it fail?

All of these points are vital to know if you are wanting to resolve this matter quickly. This is why:

1. The exact date of purchase can determince the exact nature of your rights.
2. If you bought it from Dabs your contract is with Dabs and any redress will have to be obtained from Dabs. In strict legal terms it is nothing to do with Fujitsu!
3. The exact date when the fault first appeared, the exact date that you sought advice and who from are also important.

It would be most useful, if you would like our opinions, if you could briefly describe what happened, when, who you spoke to and what the result was.

  Forum Editor 23:28 23 Nov 2003

could I ask that you don't post the contents of any further letters in full? Just a simple precis will do, outlining the salient facts.

As bfoc has said, it will help if you tell us exactly what the problem is - I know that there's a dry joint, but which socket is involved?

Before you start threatening anyone with Watchdog/court action etc. it might be an idea to handle the problem in a logical way. Your first recourse is, as bfoc says, to the company from whom you purchased the machine. They have an obligation in law to repair the fault, if it revealed itself within six months of purchase,provided it wasn't caused by misuse. It's important to deal with the right people - you should not be corresponding directly with Fujitsu Siemens at this point, or their appointed agents, although Dabs may well suggest that you do so after you talk to them. Dabs will almost certainly not effect the repair themselves, and may suggest that you contact Fujitsu Siemens, but that's something for them to decide - and not a decision that you should take for them. It's very important to get the procedure right, and to record the events in the correct sequence, and in the correct detail.

I suggest that you now talk to Dabs about this, and see what their reaction is. Talk to them, don't threaten them - they've done nothing wrong, and you must give them the opportunity to fulfil their contractual obligations to you. Perhaps you'll come back to this thread and let us know what happens.

  [DELETED] 20:59 24 Nov 2003

Many thanks, all points taken and understood.

Will let you all know how I got on.



  [DELETED] 23:10 24 Nov 2003

Hope this gets sorted out to your satisfaction!

Also just to clarify a point from FE's post it is possible to make a claim against a retailer, which might involve a repair for up to 6 years after purchase, depending on what would be a 'reasonable' life for the product and the usage.

But, after 6 months, the consumer has to be willing/able to prove that a fault had been there from the point of sale. This could be an engineers report. As the FE rightly points out up to 6 months the retailer would need to prove the fault wasn't there at POS.

This thread is now locked and can not be replied to.

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