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We have discussed here before the issue that some think our security services are doing too much surveillance. I heard on Today an interview with a group of young British men of Pakistani origin who were so anti UK and were considering going to Iraq or Syria to join the "Jihad"
This is a big problem as when they come back some vow to continue the jihad here. How we tackle it is very difficult - I do not know if, for example, MI5 would tell other countries who they were, or what to do about it in general.
Tony Blair and Bush's chickens are coming home to roost - the Iraq war sparked off the whole Shiite / Sunni confrontation across the middle east and things look bleak.
To see Iran and USA discussing joint action is incredible.
GCHQ must be on overtime.
It's a hearts and minds battle which we are losing. It was lost some years ago when we turned a blind eye to dissatisfied young men(and women)and their aspirations and dare I say embraced multi-culturism which permitted extremist views to be preached to those who were most receptive. The west is viewed as a centre of depravity and in some cases they have a point with pay-day lenders charging extortionate rates, drunkenness in the streets, etc.
Agree that Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and Syria have not helped one iota.
In my opinion any civilian leaving these shores with the avowed intention of fighting in Iraq or Syria or any other country in the middle east should have their citizenship revoked, be declared a stateless person and should be refused re entry to this country.
I don't care if they were born here or not!
There is no "avowed intention",unless stated, to fight anywhere there are people whose intention is masked by various means,holiday,student visits, family visits only by diligence and specific information can the Government act.I agree that any individual should,upon being found guilty of terrorist activity,loose their rights to citizenship and be deported to the country of their crime irrespective of the nature of the circumstances within that country.Blair and Bush are as guilty as any for what has happened.
It's not like the films all gung ho,once they see a few dead blown up bodies and the other side are shooting to kill you it's to late to go home to your family. How do i know let's just say i was employed in the forces on assorted missions.
This forum is headed "This is the place for lively and thought-provoking debate... "
A topic regarding a huge threat to this country has attracted less views than (important threads as they are) Cat Litter; Plughole leaks; Strimmers and Sunglasses.
The forum seems to have lost some people recently who generate "world" discussions. I am in no way disparaging the other threads, which are interesting , but the "serious" side of the forum seems to be deficient at the moment.
When my grandfather was just a lad you could run a way to sea for adventure, then the government then encouraged 'join the Navy to see the world' and if you were really adventurous you could join the French foreign Legion.
jb - with all due respect to yourself and your 'serious' thread which you have initiated, I expect that most people [ not just those on this forum] are totally bewildered by the 24/7 bombardement of overseas news of wars from all corners of the world. Wars are complicated and I think that it is nigh-on-impossible to debate [from afar] with any semblancy of accuracy any of the issues you have alluded to. Who knows why Shiite and Sunni people are at war with each other. I have not a clue what Jihad and ISIS means. [ Honesty is the best policy, hee hee].
These are some of the reasons why I do not contribute to threads like this one, but I do enjoy reading what other people may have to say on the particular 'serious' subject, up for discussion ... and I like to think that I am learning new things from more knowledgable forumites like yourself.
Things that Oliver Cromwell did still resonate in Ireland and East Anglia. On the West Coast of Scotland, Protestant and Catholic still hold grudges that have lasted for generations. Until we are able to heal these rifts, I think that we should tread very carefully when commenting on the Sunni/Shia divide.
Until the High Heed Yins of those, and many other Sects, can sit down and hammer out some accommodation that allows them to co-exist, these problems will continue to blight the Middle East.
Until our Politicians realise that they are just Pawns in this Game and that their Religious Leaders are the Kings, Queens, Knights and Bishops, we are doomed to create more problems than we solve.
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