HP admits faulty keyboard on 2-mth laptop-options?

  Williep 10:38 15 Jul 2006

2 months ago I bought a HP laptop (8000 series) from a well known chain of stores. Ever since purchase a fault randomly kicks in every so often, sometimes once every few days, sometimes several times a day. The CONTROL key spontaneously comes on, also sometimes CAPS LOCK. Well, the PC thinks the key is being held down - though I installed a keyboard detection freeware that even when the fault occurs tells me the keys physically are working fine and are not depressed. But the PC thinks the CONTROL key is down, behaves thus and I usually end up losing whatever I'm working on and having to reboot (I do a lot of word processing and that seems to bring the fault on). The laptop really isn't fit for purpose.

After numerous calls both to the shop and to HP I stumbled across several laptop forums where lots of other people are having similar problems with the HP 8000 and 5000 series keyboards; some blame the keyboard, some say the wires from the keyboard might be overheating or shorting, some say it's a fault with BIOS settings, others a keyboard driver issue, but noone yet has a solution. I emailed HP again saying I now know I'm not the only person having problems, what do they suggest?

They wrote back saying, yes we are well aware of this problem and are working on it but don't have a solution at the moment, and advised me meanwhile to reinstall certain software patches (whose description didn't relate to the keyboard and after installing haven't made a blind bit of difference to the fault).

So in summary I have purchased, 2 months ago, a laptop whose manufaturer admits there is a fault with these models that they are as yet unable to fix. The store I bought it from asked me to send it to their headquarters for repairs - which I pointed out would be pointless, as people who have sent their laptops back to HP for replacement keyuboards or even whole laptops have been sent back new or "mended" laptops with the same problem. Even if I accepted a replacement HP 8000 series laptop there's still a good chance it too would be faulty. So I can't see the point of having it "repaired" or "replaced" with an equally defective machine. Despite showing the email from HP, the store refuses to refund me on the grounds that I'm not entitled to a refund, only (at best) a replacement. And there's no knowing how long it will be before HP can come up with a fix, if at atll. Any suggestions gratefully received - and if anyone else has a HP 8000 (or 5000) series machine with a faulty keyboard, now you know you're not alone!

  Taff™ 11:43 15 Jul 2006

I suggest that in these circumstances youare entitled to a full refund as the goods are "Not fit for purpose".

To resolve the situation I suggest you send a letter by recorded delivery to the store`s customer service director stating the facts just as you have described above. Enclose the copy of the e-mail from HP. Ask for a written response within 7 days and suggest ever so politely that you will be taking the matter to Consumer Direct click here This organisation has replaced the old Trading Standards and is supported by the governments Office Of Fair Trading.

  Pamy 11:43 15 Jul 2006

suggest you contact your local trading standards for advice, soon as.

  Taff™ 11:48 15 Jul 2006

Quote from click here
You are entitled to your money back if there is a fault with the goods, or they are any of the following:

Unsatisfactory quality
Not fit for their purpose
Misdescribed (not what they are supposed to be)
You must be able to prove that the fault was present when the goods were sold. The burden of proof is on the consumer.

Even if you have used the goods a few times, you are probably still entitled to a refund. However, if you have had some use from the goods, the trader may make a reduction from the original price when refunding the money.

If you have not had a reasonable opportunity to check the goods, you could possibly be entitled to a refund if you complain at a later date.

However, since the 31st March 2003, the Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations give you parallel or alternate rights. Instead of a refund, you may choose to ask for a replacement or a repair. Goods which do not conform to the contract within the six months after they were delivered are presumed to have been faulty when you got them. In these cases, you do not have to prove the fault was present when the goods were sold. Instead, the trader must prove that the fault was not present when the goods were sold. The burden of proof is on the trader.

If a repair or replacement is not available or turns out to be unsuitable, you could then ask for a refund. Contact Consumer Direct for further advice.

  Forum Editor 12:03 15 Jul 2006

of a manufacturing fault, and in those circumstances the manufacturer's warranty will apply of course, but that's not a great deal of help to you in the short term.

Your contract was with your supplier, and it is to your supplier that you must look for a remedy - regardless of what the supplier might say.

As Taff™ has already mentioned, any fault that manifests itself within six months of the date of purchase is deemed to have been present at the date of purchase under current consumer law, unless the supplier can demonstrate otherwise. In this case, the supplier could not possibly prove the fault wasn't there when you bought the machine, because the manufacturer's admission of a problem clearly means that it was.

In the circumstances the supplier has no option but to offer you a full refund, or another machine - different make, similar specification - because a repair clearly isn't a viable alternative - the manufacturer isn't able to make the repair. You don't want another identical computer, for obvious reasons, so it will probably be best to insist on a full refund.

  Pamy 12:07 15 Jul 2006

still advise you contact local trading standards, or what ever they are called now for advice. Further, write a letter to the Managing Director of seller asking for a refund, do not accept repair or replacement offer.

Good luck

  Forum Editor 12:15 15 Jul 2006

about this - your rights are perfectly clear. Just follow the advice we've given with regard to the refund and you'll be fine.

  spuds 12:36 15 Jul 2006

If the manufacturer is aware of a problem, and by all accounts the evidence proves it. Then make it clear to the retailer that you are expressing your rights under consumer law, and you want the matter dealt with to your satisfaction, and not their 'forced' decision.

Having a faulty machine, which the manufacturer have stated that they are unable to solve the problem at present, is not going to help you out.

  Williep 13:22 15 Jul 2006

Thanks for all the above.

The store refused a refund on the grounds that I've had it more than 28 days or whatever their "no quibble" policy is. They said they would send it off to be fixed (!) despite my showing them the email admitting to the fault. They said I was not entitled to a refund and that in offering to repair it or replace it they were going beyond what was reasonable for them to offer! They also said they had had no other customers return this model so it was an isolated fault and a replacement should be find - though when I asked them to guarentee in writing that if they supplied me with a replacement HP it would not have this fault they said "well, you can never guarentee that any computer will be completely free of problems - that's what guarentees are for!" They also rang HP who said they hadn't had any reports of problems with the 8000 series, though there were reports of this issue with the 4000 series. This is despite their email to me and the various people on the (mainly US) sites reporting problems, including HP's own user forums:

click here
click here
click here
click here
click here
click here

Now, if they won't give me a refund I suppose I could accept a replacement HP "just in case" it's a isolated fault - and admittedly the laptop is a work of art, I'm gutted that it has this problem as I looked so hard to find one that met my needs and the store says no other customers have complained (though I wonder how many £1200 laptops they actually sell and how many people who buy them would think to research the issue on the web and realise there was a problem?). But what if the replacement is no better? Should I wait to see if HP release a fix? The store where I bought it from doesn't offer any laptops except HP with this level of spec, so I don't want them to exchange it for another brand as I won't be satisfied with the spec.

  Pamy 13:41 15 Jul 2006

Never mind their no quibble or 28 day policy, your rights are as described by FE. Write to the Managing Director and ask for a refund

  ade.h 13:57 15 Jul 2006

Can you clarify the model number for me? Is this an nx8000-series?

I'm typing this on an nx8220, which has been rock solid for nine months and counting. It does a large part of my business work and is used 7 days a week. I wasn't aware of the problems that you have described.

If your model has the quick turn-around collect and return replacement warranty (as mine does) you at least have that as a backup if this "store" - and the 28-day reference suggests a member of DSG - does not fulfil its obligations to you.

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