£461 from my account AFTER cancellation

  kinger 13:39 26 Nov 2005

I replied to a computer/Internet company's mail shot that offered a book about starting up in business with your own website on the Internet.

The company is ZedOne Marketing click here

It was £50.00 for their manual/book (payable immediately) where, once received, you could sign a standing order with your bank for £461.00 to activate in one year's time to have your own website and a support site.

October 2004 I signed the Standing Order and sent it off.

I received the information by return all about what you would get for your money.

To my surprise, the website they were offering for this amount of money was the same website that I was getting FREE from another company.
So I cancelled the standing order immediately.

Here we are, one year later, and they still took the £461.00 from my account. I was too late to stop it as I hadn't looked at my account for five days, which is when they took the cash.

I've asked for it back and they said 'no', 'you can't have a refund once we have received your payment'.

The bank says that they are not responsible as it's a Standing order and their is no legal rules that control it like in direct debits.

It's up to you to go to ZedOne Marketing, they said.

I've explained to ZedOne the situation but they refuse to refund. How do I stand as they say they can't find my cancellation notice.

It's cost them nothing as I've NEVER used their system. Why no refund policy?

  961 14:06 26 Nov 2005

Did you cancel the standing order with the Bank?

  kinger 14:27 26 Nov 2005

Yes, immediately that it appeared on my Internet account (over a year ago) it wasn't due to come out until October 2005.

But a representative at the bank said that as it was a standing order, although it was originally cancelled, I could have re-signed the mandate and therefore they processed it when it was re-submitted by ZedOne Marketing.

She said that it was a very unscrupulous thing to do but, had it been direct debit, I could have claimed the money back.

Apparently, Standing Orders have hardly any, if any, legal bindings.

  pj123 15:04 26 Nov 2005

kinger, my bank told me a Standing Order is completely different from a Direct Debit.

They said a Standing Order is set up by you for a specific period (say 12 months). Once that is done you can't stop it.

A Direct Debit is set up by the person you are "buying" from, which can be cancelled anytime because it is "until further notice".

In other words a Standing Order is an "agreed time" whereas a Direct Debit the "Seller" has to claim the money every month. I don't understand it myself but I never do Standing Orders anymore.

  Hamish 15:12 26 Nov 2005

For more information click here

  spuds 15:22 26 Nov 2005

I would imagine that ZedOne Marketing have a cast iron contract.Best suggestion, consult a solicitor who offers a 'first consultation free' service.

  Bernard2 15:34 26 Nov 2005

Your bank can only pay a standing order on your behalf if they are mandated to do it. If you cancelled your authority prior to the payment date then it is your bank's responsibility and they should make an immediate refund to you. Do not be fobbed off by your local branch, complain to their head office and do not be deterred. That is, of course, if you properly cancelled your instructions, hopefully in writing. It is completely wrong to say that you cannot cancel a standing order once it has been set up. I speak with 34 years banking experience!

  kinger 15:48 26 Nov 2005

It wasn't cancelled in writing with the bank Bernard2 but was with ZedOne Marketing.

With the bank I have an online system whereby all my Standing Orders are displayed.

I cancelled using the 'delete' button, which, according to the help file, literally cancels the Standing order or Direct debit, whatever you use it on.

I did this over a year ago and was shocked when the funds were taken from my account.

If I'd have reported it within 24hrs I could have had my money back but, unfortunately, I was a day too late.

The bank say they resubmitted the mandate, which is why it was paid.

  kinger 15:50 26 Nov 2005

'They' being ZedOne Marketing, who, I imagine, get lots of cancellations, so simply resubmit the mandate just before the due date to catch people out.

  961 17:43 26 Nov 2005

Sorry, I'm not clear on what happened here

A standing order is a mandate to your bank to pay a certain sum on a certain date

If you instruct the bank to cancel the order, i.e. not to pay, and you do this before the due date, then the bank will not pay. If it does, it is in error and must return the money to you. If this is what has happened, complain again, in writing, to the head office of the bank. This contract is between the bank and you and has nothing to do with ZedOne

If you cancelled the standing order on or after the due date, then you are too late and must pursue the matter with ZedOne. Note that dates involving a weekend can be complicated. You may be too late if you cancel on a non working day and the payment date is also a non working day

A direct debit is rather different. This authorisation is sent to ZedOne who then send it to the bank. Again, you can instruct the Bank not to pay and so long as you have done so before the due date the bank will not pay, or if it does must refund the money

I am not sure what the bank mean when they say they resubmitted the mandate. Who to? Only you could have given authority for the payment to be resumed

I am aware that the banks' automated systems submit payments in advance of the due date so that overnight processing can enable payment on the due date. In no way does this enable them to avoid liability for payments made where the authority has been cancelled BEFORE the due date, and there are systems to enable money paid to be recovered from the other bank in these cases.

Approach the bank again if the standing order or direct debit had been cancelled before the due date

  Bernard2 17:51 26 Nov 2005

A standing order is an agreement between you and your bank. The mandate goes nowhere else. This sounds like a direct debit which is different in that the beneficiaries put through a debit to your account. However, this cannot be done without your authority and there is an indemnity arrangement covering wrongful debits whereby your bank recredits your account and claims back on the beneficiary's bankers.

In summary, if it was a standing order the mandate is with the bank and remains in force until it expires or if it is cancelled by the customer. The beneficiaries cannot instruct them to pay. A direct debit mandate is held by the bank but the payment is in the form of a claim from the beneficiary's bank. If it was the former your bank was in the wrong and should refund you. If it was the latter then the bank should recredit you under the indemnity agreement.

Your bank statement should show what type of payment it was but if in doubt speak to your bank. I do not think you are likely to get anywhere with this company and it is your bank that holds the key to you obtaining a full refund of a payment that should not have been made.

This thread is now locked and can not be replied to.

Elsewhere on IDG sites

WPA2 hack: How secure is your Wi-Fi?

Add Depth Of Field to a photo using Tilt Shift Blur in Photoshop

iPhone tips & tricks

Comment afficher des fichiers cachés sur Mac ?